Sponsors:
Typology, Paris – Vegan, Cruelty-free skincare made in France. To receive a FREE lip & cheek balm when you make a purchase, visit uk.typology.com/evidence
Noom - sign up for your trial and get psychology-based support to lose weight for good at noom.com/evidencelocker
For pictures and more information, join us on Facebook
For a full list of resources and credits visit Evidence Locker Website
For all sponsor discount codes, visit this page
Want to support our podcast? Visit our page at Patreon
25% of Evidence Locker Patreon proceeds are donated as support to the Doe Network – solving international cold cases. To learn more about it visit their website at: https://www.doenetwork.org/
Content warning: This podcast contains details of real crimes and may not be suitable for all listeners. Discretion is advised.
Unlock more true crime content:
Visit our YouTube Channel
Follow us on Instagram
Join our Patreon community
Check out our books in the Evidence Locker Files Series on Amazon
Rate, review, and subscribe to Evidence Locker True Crime on your favorite podcast app.
Evidence Locker True Crime is independently produced. All rights reserved.
TRANSCRIPT
[00:00:06] [SPEAKER_00]: Our cases deal with true crimes and real people.
[00:00:09] [SPEAKER_00]: Some parts are graphic in nature, and listener discretion is advised.
[00:00:12] [SPEAKER_00]: Each episode is produced with the utmost respect to the victims, their families, and loved
[00:00:17] [SPEAKER_00]: ones.
[00:00:20] [SPEAKER_00]: It was a cold frost-covered morning, a Friday, February 23, 1968, when 67-year-old Maurice
[00:00:27] [SPEAKER_00]: Morris Goodman happened upon a figure lying on the ground on Carmichael Lane in front of
[00:00:33] [SPEAKER_00]: lock-up garages, not far from Langside Place in Glasgow, Scotland.
[00:00:38] [SPEAKER_00]: Such a sight wasn't that uncommon after bar room nights.
[00:00:41] [SPEAKER_00]: Likely, someone had had a bit too much to drink and passed that outside.
[00:00:46] [SPEAKER_00]: But as Maurice stepped closer intending to wake the person, he realized that was not
[00:00:50] [SPEAKER_00]: the case.
[00:00:52] [SPEAKER_00]: He was looking at the naked and terribly pale body of a young woman lying on her
[00:00:56] [SPEAKER_00]: back, with her head turned to the right.
[00:00:59] [SPEAKER_00]: Hoping things would not be as bad as they looked, Maurice nudged the body with his foot.
[00:01:04] [SPEAKER_00]: It was then that he knew the woman was long gone, as he later recalled, it was like touching
[00:01:10] [SPEAKER_00]: a block of ice.
[00:01:12] [SPEAKER_00]: In horror, Maurice ran back home to Carmichael Place to call the police.
[00:01:16] [SPEAKER_00]: There was no way for him to know it at the time, but he initiated the investigation
[00:01:20] [SPEAKER_00]: that would grow to be one of the biggest and most frustrating in Scotland's history.
[00:02:01] [SPEAKER_00]: Detective Sergeant Andrew Johnston and Detective Constable Norman MacDonald arrived at the scene
[00:02:06] [SPEAKER_00]: at about 8.10 am, thinking they were going to deal with a simple case of death from exposure.
[00:02:11] [SPEAKER_00]: But as they took a closer look at the body, detectives saw ligature markings on the
[00:02:15] [SPEAKER_00]: woman's neck.
[00:02:16] [SPEAKER_00]: This was a homicide, not an accident.
[00:02:20] [SPEAKER_00]: According to police pathologist Dr. James Emory, the victim had been dead for a few hours before
[00:02:26] [SPEAKER_00]: the body was discovered.
[00:02:28] [SPEAKER_00]: The woman's clothes were nowhere to be seen nor was the murder weapon.
[00:02:32] [SPEAKER_00]: The victim had suffered extensive face and head injuries, but Dr. Emory speculated she
[00:02:36] [SPEAKER_00]: had been strangled to death with a belt.
[00:02:38] [SPEAKER_00]: The subsequent autopsy confirmed the cause of death and even though no clear signs
[00:02:42] [SPEAKER_00]: of sexual assault were found, it was believed the victim was almost certainly
[00:02:46] [SPEAKER_00]: raped.
[00:02:46] [SPEAKER_00]: The medical examiner also noted the woman was on her period at the time of death.
[00:02:52] [SPEAKER_00]: A detail that may sound insignificant, but would prove strangely important later.
[00:02:58] [SPEAKER_00]: The investigators discovered a sanitary towel at the crime scene.
[00:03:02] [SPEAKER_00]: Despite the killer carefully taking everything else with him, extensive door-to-door inquiries
[00:03:06] [SPEAKER_00]: followed in an effort to find potential witnesses and identify the victim.
[00:03:10] [SPEAKER_00]: But despite the fact there had been a big party in the neighborhood that night,
[00:03:14] [SPEAKER_00]: nobody remembered seeing or hearing anything strange.
[00:03:19] [SPEAKER_00]: Nobody but one woman who told the police that sometime during Thursday evening she had heard
[00:03:24] [SPEAKER_00]: a woman scream, leave me alone twice.
[00:03:27] [SPEAKER_00]: It was possible the woman had heard some of the last words of the victim, but there
[00:03:31] [SPEAKER_00]: was no way for the police to tie the account to the unidentified body.
[00:03:35] [SPEAKER_00]: In the end, the inquiries left the police practically empty-handed and no closer to
[00:03:40] [SPEAKER_00]: finding out who the woman was.
[00:03:42] [SPEAKER_00]: However, a breakthrough soon followed, totally by chance when an ambulance driver happened
[00:03:47] [SPEAKER_00]: to see the body at the morgue at Victoria Hospital.
[00:03:51] [SPEAKER_00]: Due to severe facial injuries, other employees of the facility had failed to recognize
[00:03:55] [SPEAKER_00]: one of their own.
[00:03:57] [SPEAKER_00]: But the driver could tell this person was Patricia Docker, a 25-year-old nursing assistant.
[00:04:03] [SPEAKER_00]: The driver's suspicion was confirmed the following day when John Wilson,
[00:04:06] [SPEAKER_00]: Patricia's father, arrived at the police station to report his daughter missing
[00:04:09] [SPEAKER_00]: as she had failed to return home after a night at the majestic ballroom.
[00:04:14] [SPEAKER_00]: One look at the photo John had with him of Patricia was enough for the detectives to know
[00:04:18] [SPEAKER_00]: the young woman had already been found.
[00:04:20] [SPEAKER_00]: John was taken to the morgue where he officially identified the body
[00:04:24] [SPEAKER_00]: of the murdered young woman, as his daughter.
[00:04:27] [SPEAKER_00]: Patricia Docker had been a lively young woman with a cheeky smile,
[00:04:30] [SPEAKER_00]: short brown wavy hair, gentle hazel eyes, and a slim 5'3'' figure.
[00:04:36] [SPEAKER_00]: She worked at Mearnskirk Hospital, working night shifts which started at 10pm
[00:04:40] [SPEAKER_00]: and finished the following morning at 8.
[00:04:43] [SPEAKER_00]: Her work and the fact she was a single mother of a 4-year-old son kept Patricia busy.
[00:04:48] [SPEAKER_00]: Patricia had married her son's father, Alex Docker, 5 years prior,
[00:04:53] [SPEAKER_00]: but the couple had since separated and Patricia had moved back into her parents'
[00:04:56] [SPEAKER_00]: house in Glasgow at 29 Langside Place.
[00:05:00] [SPEAKER_00]: Having her parents around gave Patricia the opportunity to sometimes have time to herself
[00:05:04] [SPEAKER_00]: and enjoy a child-free night dancing in one of Glasgow's dance halls.
[00:05:09] [SPEAKER_00]: According to John, that is exactly what his daughter was planning to do on the night of her murder.
[00:05:15] [SPEAKER_00]: He told the detectives Patricia had headed out that Thursday evening
[00:05:18] [SPEAKER_00]: to meet her friends at the majestic ballroom on Hope Street.
[00:05:21] [SPEAKER_00]: Back in the 1960s, ballrooms were the UK's second most popular form of entertainment,
[00:05:27] [SPEAKER_00]: only surpassed by the cinema.
[00:05:29] [SPEAKER_00]: In Glasgow alone, there were 14 permanent dance halls,
[00:05:32] [SPEAKER_00]: including the La Carnault, the Majestic and the Plaza.
[00:05:37] [SPEAKER_00]: A newspaper survey at the time showed how important the ballrooms really were,
[00:05:40] [SPEAKER_00]: suggesting that as many as 70% of all married couples in the UK had met dancing.
[00:05:46] [SPEAKER_00]: Patricia and her estranged husband had also met at a dance hall,
[00:05:50] [SPEAKER_00]: but the failed marriage had not reduced her love for dancing.
[00:05:54] [SPEAKER_00]: Knowing the victim's identity and assumed plans before their death,
[00:05:58] [SPEAKER_00]: the police began to trace Patricia's last steps.
[00:06:01] [SPEAKER_00]: The detectives interviewed people who had visited the majestic ballroom
[00:06:04] [SPEAKER_00]: on Thursday, February 22nd and even found a witness who remembered dancing with Patricia.
[00:06:09] [SPEAKER_00]: But this person later retracted his statement, saying he got the night wrong.
[00:06:13] [SPEAKER_00]: It took several days before the police finally found out that the majestic
[00:06:16] [SPEAKER_00]: wasn't the only dance hall Patricia visited on the night of her murder.
[00:06:21] [SPEAKER_00]: Patricia and her friends had been dancing at the majestic ballroom,
[00:06:24] [SPEAKER_00]: listening to the resident band Dr. Cough and his crackpots,
[00:06:27] [SPEAKER_00]: but at some point, Patricia had changed the location without her friends.
[00:06:32] [SPEAKER_00]: Nobody could say for sure if Patricia always intended to go to another dance hall
[00:06:35] [SPEAKER_00]: called Barreland Ballroom or if something drew her there after the majestic closed at 10.30pm.
[00:06:41] [SPEAKER_00]: That something could have been the fact that Thursdays and Saturdays at the Barrelands
[00:06:45] [SPEAKER_00]: were Palay Night when only over 25s were allowed in.
[00:06:50] [SPEAKER_00]: These nights had a certain reputation, while single people came to dance, drink and flirt,
[00:06:55] [SPEAKER_00]: so didn't marry people, but without their partners.
[00:06:59] [SPEAKER_00]: If you were looking for an extra marital affair or a trist of some sort,
[00:07:03] [SPEAKER_00]: Barreland was the place to go. At the time, people were joking about the attendees who
[00:07:09] [SPEAKER_00]: stopped at the entrance to slip off their wedding rings before stepping in.
[00:07:13] [SPEAKER_00]: One Glasgow resident described the Palay nights by saying,
[00:07:17] [SPEAKER_00]: It was well known that if you wanted a bit more than a dance then Thursday night was
[00:07:21] [SPEAKER_00]: the evening to visit the Barreland. I don't think many used their actual name on a Thursday night,
[00:07:26] [SPEAKER_00]: folk were cautious. Anything that happened after dancing was finished was usually a one-off.
[00:07:33] [SPEAKER_00]: The Barreland Ballroom's reputation could have been why Patricia didn't mention it to her parents.
[00:07:38] [SPEAKER_00]: Despite the fact she had moved out of her husband's house, Patricia was still technically
[00:07:42] [SPEAKER_00]: a married woman and telling her parents about Barreland could have caused an awkward conversation.
[00:07:47] [SPEAKER_00]: Of course, Patricia may have simply wanted to continue the evening at the only dance hall that
[00:07:53] [SPEAKER_00]: was still open. Whatever the reason was, by the time the detectives realized Patricia had gone
[00:07:58] [SPEAKER_00]: to the Barreland on that Thursday night, the trail was already getting cold.
[00:08:03] [SPEAKER_00]: While several witnesses came forward saying they saw Patricia in a yellow dress dancing
[00:08:07] [SPEAKER_00]: with a number of men, including one with red hair, nobody could remember seeing her leave.
[00:08:14] [SPEAKER_00]: The spot where Patricia's body was later found was about 4.8 kilometers from the Barreland Ballroom
[00:08:19] [SPEAKER_00]: and only a few hundred meters from the home of her parents. The police were unable to find anyone
[00:08:25] [SPEAKER_00]: recalling seeing a young woman in a yellow dress walking the route, so it was likely Patricia
[00:08:30] [SPEAKER_00]: had taken the taxi or had been given a lift, possibly by her killer.
[00:08:36] [SPEAKER_00]: Despite extensive searches of the area, the investigators never found Patricia's
[00:08:42] [SPEAKER_00]: handbag and her bracelet in a small river around 100 meters from where she was found.
[00:08:48] [SPEAKER_00]: The police were puzzled by why the killer had thrown away some of Patricia's belongings,
[00:08:52] [SPEAKER_00]: but kept their clothes. Perhaps they contained incriminating evidence or
[00:08:57] [SPEAKER_00]: they were taken to souvenirs. It seemed that instead of finding answers as time passed,
[00:09:03] [SPEAKER_00]: there were only more questions. The only potential suspect the police had was Patricia's
[00:09:08] [SPEAKER_00]: husband, Alex. But he was quickly ruled out when his alibi was confirmed. He had been at RAF
[00:09:14] [SPEAKER_00]: Digby in Lincolnshire at the time of the murder, more than 400 kilometers away. Within weeks,
[00:09:22] [SPEAKER_00]: the investigation into Patricia Dockers death began to slow down before eventually coming to
[00:09:27] [SPEAKER_00]: a standstill. Little by little, the terrible death of the young woman was not totally forgotten,
[00:09:32] [SPEAKER_00]: but faded into the background. 18 months later, on Saturday, August 16, 1969, when 32-year-old
[00:09:40] [SPEAKER_00]: Jemima McDonald was planning to spend a night at the Barreland Ballroom, the unsolved murder
[00:09:45] [SPEAKER_00]: didn't even cross her mind. Jemima resembled Patricia. She was also attractive, slim,
[00:09:52] [SPEAKER_00]: a mother of three children and she loved to dance. The McDonalds lived in a tenement
[00:09:57] [SPEAKER_00]: building at 15 McKeith Street in Bridgeton, near Jemima's sister Margaret. The last two nights,
[00:10:03] [SPEAKER_00]: Margaret had looked after Jemima's 12-year-old daughter and nine and seven-year-old sons as
[00:10:08] [SPEAKER_00]: she had gone out dancing. Saturday was going to be the same. Jemima dropped her children off
[00:10:13] [SPEAKER_00]: with Margaret before heading to the Barreland Ballroom, wearing a black pinafore dress,
[00:10:18] [SPEAKER_00]: white blouse, off-white slingback shoes, and warm brown coat. On her head, Jemima
[00:10:25] [SPEAKER_00]: had a scarf that covered her curlers that she planned to take off just before entering the dance
[00:10:28] [SPEAKER_00]: hall so that her hairdo would look as good as possible. Due to the fact that many of Jemima's
[00:10:34] [SPEAKER_00]: friends were married and faithful to their partners, she was going to the dance hall alone.
[00:10:40] [SPEAKER_00]: That didn't bother her though. She often went out by herself and knew she was going
[00:10:43] [SPEAKER_00]: to find someone to dance with at the over 25s night. So she stopped at Betty's Barre
[00:10:48] [SPEAKER_00]: on the Gallo Gate to have something to drink before heading to the dance hall,
[00:10:52] [SPEAKER_00]: which at the time didn't serve any alcohol. Saturday was the busiest day of the week,
[00:10:58] [SPEAKER_00]: with up to 2,000 dancers filling the dance floor. Jemima was quickly lost in the crowd,
[00:11:04] [SPEAKER_00]: dancing the night away like there was no tomorrow. But that tomorrow eventually came,
[00:11:10] [SPEAKER_00]: and Jemima failed to collect her children from her sister. Margaret immediately became concerned.
[00:11:16] [SPEAKER_00]: It was not like Jemima to fall off the grid, but perhaps she had simply had an
[00:11:20] [SPEAKER_00]: unusually long night. But then, Margaret happened to hear neighborhood children talking about
[00:11:25] [SPEAKER_00]: the body in the tenement. The timing of a rumor like that couldn't have been worse.
[00:11:31] [SPEAKER_00]: The nearby abandoned tenement building at 23 McKee Street was a playground for the children,
[00:11:36] [SPEAKER_00]: but also a home for vagrants and a place for sex workers to serve their clients.
[00:11:41] [SPEAKER_00]: If there really was a body in that tenement, it could belong to a homeless person.
[00:11:45] [SPEAKER_00]: But the fact this happened just when Jemima went MIA did not sit right with Margaret.
[00:11:53] [SPEAKER_00]: By Monday, as her sister still hadn't returned, Margaret couldn't help but head to the empty
[00:11:58] [SPEAKER_00]: building to see if the rumors were true. When she arrived at 23 McKee Street,
[00:12:03] [SPEAKER_00]: several other people were gathered around the building. Surprised, Margaret walked inside,
[00:12:09] [SPEAKER_00]: where she was directed to a bed recess by one wall on the ground floor.
[00:12:12] [SPEAKER_00]: At first, Margaret thought she was looking at a mannequin lying on the floor,
[00:12:17] [SPEAKER_00]: but then she recognized the torn black pinafore dress, the white blouse,
[00:12:20] [SPEAKER_00]: and the blighted face that belonged to her sister.
[00:12:25] [SPEAKER_00]: Jemima McDonald had been brutally beaten on her head and face,
[00:12:29] [SPEAKER_00]: raped, and strangled with one of her own stockings in the early hours of Sunday morning.
[00:12:34] [SPEAKER_00]: Most of Jemima's clothes were present, but her black patent other handbag
[00:12:38] [SPEAKER_00]: and her headscarf were missing, and were not found during subsequent searches.
[00:12:43] [SPEAKER_00]: An autopsy confirmed Jemima had been menstruating at the time of her death,
[00:12:47] [SPEAKER_00]: just like Patricia Docker, which of course could have been a total coincidence.
[00:12:54] [SPEAKER_00]: But as the investigators found a sanitary pad at the crime scene close to the body,
[00:12:58] [SPEAKER_00]: they couldn't help but wonder if the two murders were connected.
[00:13:02] [SPEAKER_00]: Upon interviewing people who had been in the area on the night of Jemima's murder,
[00:13:05] [SPEAKER_00]: the police learned very little useful information. One woman said she had heard a woman screaming,
[00:13:11] [SPEAKER_00]: but she wasn't sure about the time. In addition, another witness had said that they had seen a woman
[00:13:16] [SPEAKER_00]: who looked like Jemima talking with a man outside the empty tenement around 1240am,
[00:13:21] [SPEAKER_00]: but nobody could say for sure if it was really Jemima. Fortunately, this time,
[00:13:26] [SPEAKER_00]: the authorities knew immediately that Jemima had been at Barreland Barroom,
[00:13:30] [SPEAKER_00]: so they got to interview the attendees while their memories of the evening were still fresh.
[00:13:34] [SPEAKER_00]: Several people did remember seeing Jemima at the dance hall, and they also remember the man she
[00:13:39] [SPEAKER_00]: had been with. According to the witnesses, the person stood out because he didn't seem to fit in.
[00:13:45] [SPEAKER_00]: The man, around 25-35 years of age, was wearing a quality suit with hand-stitched lapels
[00:13:51] [SPEAKER_00]: and a white shirt and he had unfashionably short reddish hair.
[00:13:55] [SPEAKER_00]: Compared to the other dancers, this person seemed a bit too smartly dressed,
[00:14:01] [SPEAKER_00]: giving an upscale feeling. Based on the witness reports, it seemed that the same person had been
[00:14:07] [SPEAKER_00]: with Jemima at Betty's bar before the two headed to the Barreland Barroom,
[00:14:11] [SPEAKER_00]: but none of the people who remembered seeing Jemima and her companion knew who this man was
[00:14:15] [SPEAKER_00]: or could remember ever seeing him at the barroom before. Witnesses later saw Jemima leaving
[00:14:21] [SPEAKER_00]: with this person, walking down Gallo Gate before turning right onto Bain Street,
[00:14:25] [SPEAKER_00]: and then to London Road. The police received reports from people seeing the two walking
[00:14:29] [SPEAKER_00]: together on London Road between 12.15 and 12.30 am. From there, they took a shortcut by way of
[00:14:36] [SPEAKER_00]: Landresy Street and James Street. It should have taken Jemima only about 20 minutes to reach your
[00:14:41] [SPEAKER_00]: home at McKee Street, but she never made it. Although the witness reports provided a good
[00:14:46] [SPEAKER_00]: description of the man Jemima had been seen with, days kept passing without any potential
[00:14:51] [SPEAKER_00]: suspects in the case. In need of a new approach, the head of the city of Glasgow Police CID,
[00:14:56] [SPEAKER_00]: Detective Chief Superintendent Tom Goodall, asked George Lenick Patterson,
[00:15:00] [SPEAKER_00]: Deputy Director of the Glasgow School of Art to create a painting of the red-haired man's face.
[00:15:06] [SPEAKER_00]: Something like this had never been done in the history of Scottish criminal investigation,
[00:15:09] [SPEAKER_00]: and Goodall had to ask for official permissions from the Crown Office in Edinburgh.
[00:15:14] [SPEAKER_00]: After getting the green light, the sketch was created based on the witness reports
[00:15:18] [SPEAKER_00]: and released to the press on Tuesday, August 26th, 10 days after Jemima's death.
[00:15:24] [SPEAKER_00]: Lenick's Patterson's impression of the suspect and the murder of Jemima McDonald
[00:15:27] [SPEAKER_00]: would eventually become infamous. Not just because of how accurate the sketch was thought to be,
[00:15:33] [SPEAKER_00]: but because of the mocking expression on the supposed killer's face.
[00:15:37] [SPEAKER_00]: It was believed that with such a clear image of the suspect's face,
[00:15:41] [SPEAKER_00]: somebody would recognize him in no time. But despite the portrait becoming a media sensation,
[00:15:47] [SPEAKER_00]: no new leads were produced, and the police still had no name for the red-haired man.
[00:15:52] [SPEAKER_00]: Soon, just like what had happened with Patricia Dockers' murder investigation,
[00:15:56] [SPEAKER_00]: Jemima's case hit a brick wall. And then, just two months after the second murder,
[00:16:02] [SPEAKER_00]: another young woman lost her life.
[00:16:05] [SPEAKER_00]: 29-year-old Helen Puttick had just returned to Glasgow with her husband George and their
[00:16:09] [SPEAKER_00]: two young children after a long stay in Germany. George was a corporal in the British Army,
[00:16:14] [SPEAKER_00]: and Helen had initially followed her husband on his posting. But in the end,
[00:16:19] [SPEAKER_00]: life as an army wife was not for her. So by 1969, Helen and the couple's two sons,
[00:16:26] [SPEAKER_00]: David and Michael, had moved back to Glasgow to live temporarily with her mother at 129 Earl Street.
[00:16:32] [SPEAKER_00]: To be closer to his family, George applied for a posting near Glasgow,
[00:16:36] [SPEAKER_00]: and in the meantime, spent all his leaves with his wife and children.
[00:16:40] [SPEAKER_00]: On Thursday, October 30th, 1969, George was at his home in Glasgow,
[00:16:44] [SPEAKER_00]: and on that night, Helen wanted to go out dancing with her older sister, Jeanne Lankford.
[00:16:50] [SPEAKER_00]: George was a too keen on Helen going out without him, feeling that dancing was a rather
[00:16:54] [SPEAKER_00]: inappropriate thing to do as a married woman. But Helen managed to convince George,
[00:16:59] [SPEAKER_00]: explaining she just wanted to enjoy herself and have fun with her sister.
[00:17:03] [SPEAKER_00]: It wasn't like Helen had a lot of free time for herself as a mother of a five-year-old in
[00:17:06] [SPEAKER_00]: an infant. Before Helen and Jeanne left for the bus at about 8pm, George gave his wife
[00:17:12] [SPEAKER_00]: 10 shillings to use for a taxi back home. Helen, who was wearing a black sleeveless dress,
[00:17:18] [SPEAKER_00]: black shoes and a fake fur ocelot coat, smiled and assured her husband she would not stay out too
[00:17:24] [SPEAKER_00]: late. In the city centre, the two sisters visited a few pubs for drinks before heading to the
[00:17:30] [SPEAKER_00]: barrel land ballroom where they arrived at approximately 10pm. Although Helen and Jeanne
[00:17:35] [SPEAKER_00]: had heard about the murder of Jemima McDonald just 10 weeks earlier and the possible connection
[00:17:39] [SPEAKER_00]: to the death of another young woman, neither was particularly worried.
[00:17:43] [SPEAKER_00]: Unlike Jemima and Patricia, the sisters were not alone and would look after each other.
[00:17:48] [SPEAKER_00]: What could go wrong? The following morning at 7.30, a man named Archibald McIntyre was
[00:17:54] [SPEAKER_00]: walking his dog along Earl Street into the enclosed garden behind the apartment building.
[00:17:59] [SPEAKER_00]: It was then that Archibald's dog began sniffing as if there was something left
[00:18:03] [SPEAKER_00]: lying on the ground. Archibald followed his pet and soon stumbled upon a grisly scene.
[00:18:08] [SPEAKER_00]: The body of a young woman with a pair of stockings nodded around her neck.
[00:18:14] [SPEAKER_00]: When the police arrived, they discovered the woman lying on the ground face down
[00:18:18] [SPEAKER_00]: with her clothes torn and her face so badly beaten she was unrecognizable.
[00:18:23] [SPEAKER_00]: A medical examiner later confirmed the woman had been raped before she was strangled to death.
[00:18:29] [SPEAKER_00]: She also had bite marks on her body. Some reports say they were found on her wrists,
[00:18:33] [SPEAKER_00]: some say on her buttocks or thigh, and she had been menstruating at the time of her death.
[00:18:39] [SPEAKER_00]: A sanitary pad was found placed underneath the woman's left armpit,
[00:18:43] [SPEAKER_00]: and there was a semen stain on her tights. The similarities to the deaths of Jemima McDonald
[00:18:48] [SPEAKER_00]: and Patricia Docker didn't go unnoticed. It began to seem like there was a serial killer
[00:18:53] [SPEAKER_00]: on the loose in Glasgow. After the discovery of the body, the police set up an incident
[00:18:59] [SPEAKER_00]: caravan outside of the door of 95 Earl Street. When George Puttack woke up that morning
[00:19:04] [SPEAKER_00]: and realized his wife had still not returned home, he glanced out the window and noticed the caravan.
[00:19:10] [SPEAKER_00]: While George didn't know why the police were in his neighborhood,
[00:19:13] [SPEAKER_00]: he was glad he could go and speak with an officer straight away about Helen being missing.
[00:19:18] [SPEAKER_00]: So George approached the caravan and explained the situation to the nearest officer
[00:19:22] [SPEAKER_00]: who then asked what Helen had been wearing the night before.
[00:19:25] [SPEAKER_00]: As soon as George mentioned the faux fur coat, it was realized the badly beaten body
[00:19:30] [SPEAKER_00]: belonged to Helen Puttack.
[00:19:34] [SPEAKER_00]: Naturally, the police immediately needed to speak with Jeannie Langford, the person who had gone out
[00:19:39] [SPEAKER_00]: with Helen and supposedly stayed with her the whole night. Jeannie however, was so distraught upon
[00:19:44] [SPEAKER_00]: hearing the news about her sister's death, it took a while before the detectives were able
[00:19:48] [SPEAKER_00]: to interview her. But when they did, it was learned that Jeannie had not just seen the potential
[00:19:53] [SPEAKER_00]: suspect, she had also spoken to him and that they shared a taxi. According to Jeannie,
[00:19:59] [SPEAKER_00]: as soon as they arrived at the Bearland Barroom, she got together with a gentleman who said his name
[00:20:04] [SPEAKER_00]: was John. Helen also found herself a companion, a tall young man who appeared suave and a little
[00:20:10] [SPEAKER_00]: sophisticated. The four of them danced and chatted and the women eventually laughed after
[00:20:14] [SPEAKER_00]: learning both of them were called John or so they claimed. It wasn't strange for people
[00:20:19] [SPEAKER_00]: to use aliases during over 25 nights and based on Helen's partner's behavior, Jeannie felt
[00:20:25] [SPEAKER_00]: like he wasn't completely honest as she later recalled. I don't believe either of them were
[00:20:30] [SPEAKER_00]: called John, in fact the man I was dancing with was first to introduce himself to the others.
[00:20:36] [SPEAKER_00]: When it came to Helen's partner, he seemed to pause for a second or two before giving his name
[00:20:40] [SPEAKER_00]: as John. He seemed a bit apprehensive and it was the only time I saw him look less than
[00:20:45] [SPEAKER_00]: confident because he seemed so certain of himself in every other way. Neither Jeannie
[00:20:50] [SPEAKER_00]: nor Helen really cared about whether these men were named John or something else and if
[00:20:54] [SPEAKER_00]: they were married or not. The sisters just wanted to dance and have some fun.
[00:20:59] [SPEAKER_00]: The four spent just over an hour together at the barrel land before it was time to leave at 11.30
[00:21:03] [SPEAKER_00]: p.m. On their way out, Jeannie tried to buy cigarettes from a vending machine but lost her
[00:21:09] [SPEAKER_00]: money due to a malfunction. Jeannie later explained to the police that at this point
[00:21:13] [SPEAKER_00]: her sister's red-haired companion became a bit overly irritated and demanded to speak with
[00:21:18] [SPEAKER_00]: the manager. But not at any point was this person outraged or shouting. Instead, he
[00:21:24] [SPEAKER_00]: spoke in a collected manner sounding like a school teacher speaking to a young child.
[00:21:29] [SPEAKER_00]: While Jeannie thought John would end up being kicked out by a bouncer because of speaking
[00:21:32] [SPEAKER_00]: to the manager in a way he did, the manager actually agreed with him and said Jeannie should
[00:21:37] [SPEAKER_00]: return the following day to get her refund. And so, the four continued their way. Helen's
[00:21:43] [SPEAKER_00]: John murmuring something along the line of, my father says these places are dens of
[00:21:47] [SPEAKER_00]: iniquity. Outside, Helen red-haired John and Jeannie walked towards Glasgow Cross to hail a taxi
[00:21:54] [SPEAKER_00]: while the other John headed to the city center as he intended to catch a bus to Castle Milk.
[00:22:00] [SPEAKER_00]: During the 20 minute drive back to Scottsden, Jeannie noted John seemed even more irritated than
[00:22:05] [SPEAKER_00]: before but perhaps it was because she was a third wheel in this man's eyes. Jeannie later
[00:22:11] [SPEAKER_00]: told the detectives this John was approximately 25 to 30 years old, tall, somewhere around
[00:22:16] [SPEAKER_00]: six feet with a medium build. He had light, arbor and reddish hair brushed to the right
[00:22:21] [SPEAKER_00]: and grayish blue eyes. Jeannie also noticed that John had good teeth with one imperfection.
[00:22:27] [SPEAKER_00]: One of his teeth on the upper right jaw overlapped the next tooth. That night, John was wearing
[00:22:34] [SPEAKER_00]: a brownish, flecked single-breasted suit, a knee length brownish coat of tweed or garbadean,
[00:22:40] [SPEAKER_00]: a light blue shirt in a dark tie with red diagonal stripes.
[00:22:44] [SPEAKER_00]: Jeannie recalled John having a metal badge on the lapel of his jacket that he was constantly touching
[00:22:48] [SPEAKER_00]: and rubbing for one reason or another and that he had been smoking embassy brand cigarettes.
[00:22:54] [SPEAKER_00]: While John had shared very little about himself back at Barreland, in the taxi
[00:22:58] [SPEAKER_00]: he told the two sisters his surname was either Templeton or Sempelson. He lived
[00:23:03] [SPEAKER_00]: in the Castle Milk area with a relative and he was unmarried. Strangely,
[00:23:08] [SPEAKER_00]: when Jeannie asked of John like dancing, he became almost angry, speaking about adulterous women
[00:23:13] [SPEAKER_00]: attending the city's dance halls. John said he had been raised in a very strict religious household,
[00:23:19] [SPEAKER_00]: which explained his habit of quoting religious scripture throughout the conversation.
[00:23:23] [SPEAKER_00]: When Jeannie asked what John was planning to do on New Year's Eve or
[00:23:25] [SPEAKER_00]: Hogmanay as the Scottish say, he replied,
[00:23:30] [SPEAKER_00]: I don't dance at Hogmanay, I pray. It was about 12.30 am on Friday night that
[00:23:35] [SPEAKER_00]: the cab driver left Jeannie at her home on Kelso Street before taking John and Helen to Earl Street.
[00:23:41] [SPEAKER_00]: Jeannie found it strange that John insisted that the driver took her home first,
[00:23:45] [SPEAKER_00]: about 800 meters further on. And when Jeannie was saying goodbye to Helen,
[00:23:50] [SPEAKER_00]: telling her they would see each other the following week, John had slammed the door closed,
[00:23:54] [SPEAKER_00]: pretty much mid-sentence. The taxi then stopped outside 95 Earl Street. The driver told
[00:24:00] [SPEAKER_00]: the police Helen had gotten out and walked toward her home without looking back,
[00:24:03] [SPEAKER_00]: while John paid the fare and headed after her. And now an hour and a half later,
[00:24:08] [SPEAKER_00]: a number six bus stopped between Garner Street and Fort Rose Street and picked up one passenger.
[00:24:14] [SPEAKER_00]: The young man with red hair stepped in, seemingly embarrassed by his appearance,
[00:24:18] [SPEAKER_00]: looking like he had been in a fight. He had a red scratch on his face,
[00:24:21] [SPEAKER_00]: and his jacket was all muddy. When this is on the bus, remember this person repeatedly
[00:24:26] [SPEAKER_00]: tucking a short cuff of one sleeve into his jacket sleeve, which was a significant observation
[00:24:31] [SPEAKER_00]: as a man's cuff link had been found next to Helen Puddock's body.
[00:24:35] [SPEAKER_00]: The man exited the bus a short time later, and was last seen walking towards the public ferry
[00:24:40] [SPEAKER_00]: to cross the river Clyde to the south side of the city.
[00:24:43] [SPEAKER_00]: A few days later, Glasgow newspapers began publishing articles about the Bible
[00:24:47] [SPEAKER_00]: Quoting Killer alongside Jeannie's description of John. Soon, this individual was given the
[00:24:53] [SPEAKER_00]: name that we still know today more than five decades later, Bible John. After Helen's
[00:25:02] [SPEAKER_00]: death, the police were sure they were about to catch Bible John at any moment.
[00:25:06] [SPEAKER_00]: There were too many witnesses and too many detailed descriptions of his appearance
[00:25:09] [SPEAKER_00]: and behavior for him to go unidentified for much longer.
[00:25:13] [SPEAKER_00]: Jeannie was shown the portrait made by George Lennox Patterson, which she commented on by saying,
[00:25:18] [SPEAKER_00]: My whole inside just churned. To me the resemblance was there. When I looked at it,
[00:25:23] [SPEAKER_00]: it's a funny feeling. It's like something just turns in your guts, you know?
[00:25:26] [SPEAKER_00]: It's like a wee kind of shiver or something. When I saw that I thought,
[00:25:29] [SPEAKER_00]: God, that's a terrific resemblance. Jeannie's reaction seemed to confirm that whoever
[00:25:35] [SPEAKER_00]: had killed her sister was also responsible for the death of Jemima McDonald. George and Jeannie
[00:25:39] [SPEAKER_00]: worked together to improve the painting of Bible John and make it even more accurate.
[00:25:44] [SPEAKER_00]: This time, George created a full-color version that was sent to the press
[00:25:48] [SPEAKER_00]: and widely distributed throughout the United Kingdom. Jeannie also helped Glasgow City Police
[00:25:53] [SPEAKER_00]: photo-fit technicians to create another composite image of Bible John's face.
[00:25:57] [SPEAKER_00]: Due to the fact this man had been seen wearing a type of watch favored by servicemen,
[00:26:02] [SPEAKER_00]: and because of his short and neat hair, Bible John's picture and description
[00:26:05] [SPEAKER_00]: were also sent to British Army bases and Royal Navy ships.
[00:26:09] [SPEAKER_00]: The authorities felt confident Bible John's random terror would finally come to an end.
[00:26:14] [SPEAKER_00]: The appeals resulted in numerous reports from witnesses who had thought they had seen
[00:26:18] [SPEAKER_00]: the man known as Bible John. The police spent countless hours investigating these leads
[00:26:23] [SPEAKER_00]: and bringing men in for lineups, but Jeannie didn't recognize any of them.
[00:26:28] [SPEAKER_00]: Meanwhile, the barrel land became a stakeout point where 16 police officers kept an eye on
[00:26:32] [SPEAKER_00]: the attendees of the notorious over 25 knights. Due to the fact that the investigators had to
[00:26:38] [SPEAKER_00]: do everything in their power to blend in, the press eventually dubbed the group as
[00:26:42] [SPEAKER_00]: Marine Formation Dance Team. Constable Bruce Forsythe later told a local newspaper,
[00:26:47] [SPEAKER_00]: when this inquiry started, I could hardly dance a step, now I get better every week.
[00:26:51] [SPEAKER_00]: But while the officers' dancing skills improved, they failed to identify any viable suspects.
[00:26:58] [SPEAKER_00]: The same results came back after detectives analyzed British military and NATO records.
[00:27:03] [SPEAKER_00]: It was thought that because Patricia and Jemima had been killed 18 months apart,
[00:27:07] [SPEAKER_00]: Bible John may have been posted abroad during that time.
[00:27:10] [SPEAKER_00]: Unfortunately, nothing helpful was ever found. The police also spoke with over 450
[00:27:15] [SPEAKER_00]: hairdressers in and around Glasgow in addition to numerous tailors and dentists.
[00:27:20] [SPEAKER_00]: Bible John's hairstyle wasn't typical for the era, but none of the barbers remembered a client
[00:27:25] [SPEAKER_00]: matching his description. The dentist's offices provided records of over 5,000 patients
[00:27:30] [SPEAKER_00]: with an overlapping front tooth in the upper jaw, but in the end, the inquiry proved fruitless.
[00:27:37] [SPEAKER_00]: All 5,000 men were located and cleared. And it was not just that the police weren't able
[00:27:43] [SPEAKER_00]: to locate Bible John, they didn't find the other John either. The detectives would have
[00:27:48] [SPEAKER_00]: wanted to speak with him as he was the only other person who had spent time in Bible John's presence
[00:27:52] [SPEAKER_00]: that was still alive. The second John eventually became known as Castle Milk John because of where
[00:27:58] [SPEAKER_00]: he was heading after the night out. The authorities spent a lot of time looking for this individual,
[00:28:03] [SPEAKER_00]: but it was thought that Castle Milk John was purposely avoiding the police because he didn't
[00:28:07] [SPEAKER_00]: want someone to find out that he had been at the barrel land that night.
[00:28:10] [SPEAKER_00]: Perhaps he was a married man who had used a false name and now refused to help with
[00:28:14] [SPEAKER_00]: the murder investigation so that his actions would not become public. Whatever the reason was,
[00:28:19] [SPEAKER_00]: the fact that Castle Milk John never came forward was a big blow for the police. But when one line
[00:28:25] [SPEAKER_00]: of investigation failed, the detectives moved to another one. No stone was left unturned.
[00:28:32] [SPEAKER_00]: Officers visited over 400 golf courses across Scotland because Jeannie remembered
[00:28:35] [SPEAKER_00]: Bible John talking about golf and his cousin achieving a hole in one.
[00:28:40] [SPEAKER_00]: Numerous churches were also investigated, but no viable suspects were found.
[00:28:44] [SPEAKER_00]: In time, the search for Bible John grew to one of the biggest ever undertaken by a Scottish police
[00:28:49] [SPEAKER_00]: force. Door-to-door inquiries produced over 50,000 witness statements. More than 5,000 potential
[00:28:55] [SPEAKER_00]: suspects were questioned within a year and over 100 detectives and police officers were involved
[00:29:00] [SPEAKER_00]: in the inquiry. And yet it's seen that police never got closer to finding Bible John.
[00:29:06] [SPEAKER_00]: As conventional investigation methods failed, the Scottish Daily Records eventually paid for
[00:29:10] [SPEAKER_00]: psychic and parapsychologist Gerard Kreuzett to visit Glasgow and hopefully help in the search.
[00:29:16] [SPEAKER_00]: According to Gerard, Bible John lived in the Govan area in a particular looking house, but
[00:29:21] [SPEAKER_00]: again, door-to-door inquiries yielded nothing. After coming up empty-handed once more,
[00:29:27] [SPEAKER_00]: the psychic's side step was described as a waste of time. Although nothing else had
[00:29:31] [SPEAKER_00]: produced results either, the investigation into the three murders gradually became cold
[00:29:36] [SPEAKER_00]: and resources were moved to be used in different cases. The only good thing seemed to be that
[00:29:41] [SPEAKER_00]: while the police had failed to locate Bible John, he had also stopped killing. Because no more murders
[00:29:46] [SPEAKER_00]: followed the death of Helen Puttick, it was believed Bible John moved away, continued killing
[00:29:50] [SPEAKER_00]: somewhere else, was jailed for an unrelated offense, or was incarcerated at a mental hospital.
[00:29:57] [SPEAKER_00]: Of course, it was possible that he simply decided to stop due to the massive manhunt.
[00:30:01] [SPEAKER_00]: It was difficult for the detectives to understand how nobody had come forward
[00:30:04] [SPEAKER_00]: positively identifying the man despite the detailed description and sketch,
[00:30:09] [SPEAKER_00]: as Detective Superintendent Joe Beattie said after his retirement in 1976,
[00:30:14] [SPEAKER_00]: sometimes you get the ones you shouldn't get, and you don't get the ones you should.
[00:30:18] [SPEAKER_00]: This was one we should have got. We knew so much about him, it is quite incredible that
[00:30:23] [SPEAKER_00]: this man has eluded us. Still over the years some names have popped up as potential suspects.
[00:30:29] [SPEAKER_00]: One of them was a man known as John White. This individual was arrested in late 1969.
[00:30:34] [SPEAKER_00]: Outside the barrel and ballroom following an argument with a woman. Detective Les Brown,
[00:30:39] [SPEAKER_00]: who was present at the time, noticed John's resemblance to Bible John and he was taken in
[00:30:43] [SPEAKER_00]: to be questioned. But there was one obvious issue. John White didn't have notably overlapping
[00:30:48] [SPEAKER_00]: front teeth. Still, he was considered a viable suspect for the Bible John murders for quite
[00:30:53] [SPEAKER_00]: some time. Detective Brown's suspicions were further raised because John White's name
[00:30:57] [SPEAKER_00]: wasn't really John White, but John Edgar. He had also given a false address to the police.
[00:31:03] [SPEAKER_00]: Ultimately, there was no evidence linking him to the crimes of Bible John and he was released
[00:31:06] [SPEAKER_00]: without charges. Years later, after Detective Brown published an autobiography including a
[00:31:12] [SPEAKER_00]: chapter about John White, John Edgar contacted authorities and offered to provide a DNA sample
[00:31:17] [SPEAKER_00]: to clear his name. Apparently this was never done, but it seems unlikely John Edgar had
[00:31:22] [SPEAKER_00]: anything to do with the murders. Another suspect was a man named John Irvine McInnes,
[00:31:27] [SPEAKER_00]: an ex-soldier in furniture salesman. John came from a strong religious background and was known
[00:31:32] [SPEAKER_00]: to be a heavy drinker and gambler. Witnesses placed John at the barrel and ballroom the
[00:31:36] [SPEAKER_00]: night before Helen Puddock was murdered and he did resemble the description of Bible John.
[00:31:41] [SPEAKER_00]: But the thing is, during the investigation, John McInnes was included in more than one
[00:31:46] [SPEAKER_00]: identity parade and Jeannie Langford never picked him out. John also didn't have crooked front
[00:31:51] [SPEAKER_00]: teeth and his jug ears didn't match those of the man Jeannie had seen. Eventually, John was
[00:31:56] [SPEAKER_00]: eliminated as a suspect in 1969 and yet almost three decades later in 1996, his body was exhumed
[00:32:03] [SPEAKER_00]: after a cold case investigation put him under suspicion again. John died in 1980 at the age of
[00:32:09] [SPEAKER_00]: 41 of a self-inflicted wound that severed the brachial artery in his arm and after a DNA
[00:32:14] [SPEAKER_00]: sample taken from Helen's tights was linked to a member of the McInnes family as an 80% match,
[00:32:19] [SPEAKER_00]: the investigators wanted to test his DNA too. For a moment it was thought that Bible John
[00:32:24] [SPEAKER_00]: was finally going to be identified and the case closed. But several test results conducted proved
[00:32:30] [SPEAKER_00]: inconclusive and John McInnes was again cleared as a suspect in July 1996. Finally, the person who
[00:32:38] [SPEAKER_00]: would cause the most speculation was convicted serial killer Peter Tobin. In 2006, Peter raped
[00:32:44] [SPEAKER_00]: Polish student Angelica Kluk before beating and stabbing her to death. Investigators had a
[00:32:49] [SPEAKER_00]: feeling that the killing wasn't Peter's first. Their suspicion was later confirmed when
[00:32:53] [SPEAKER_00]: the bodies of 18-year-old dynamic Nickel and 15-year-old Vicki Hamilton were found buried in
[00:32:58] [SPEAKER_00]: the garden of a house in which Peter had previously lived. Once the police investigated Peter's background,
[00:33:05] [SPEAKER_00]: they learned he had been living in Glasgow as late as 1969 before marrying and moving to Brighton.
[00:33:11] [SPEAKER_00]: That was not all. Peter was known to visit the Barreland Barroom regularly
[00:33:15] [SPEAKER_00]: and he was described as a smart dresser. Apparently, Peter also sometimes used a false
[00:33:20] [SPEAKER_00]: name, John Semple, which sounded similar to the name Jeannie had heard in the taxi, John Sempleson.
[00:33:27] [SPEAKER_00]: After the book The Lost British Serial Killer was published in 2010, stating Peter Tobin was
[00:33:32] [SPEAKER_00]: Bible John, several women came forward stating Peter had sexually assaulted them at the Barreland
[00:33:37] [SPEAKER_00]: Barroom in the late 1960s. In addition, three of his former wives gave accounts of being in
[00:33:42] [SPEAKER_00]: prison, throttled, beaten and raped at Peter's hands and most notably he was angered by
[00:33:48] [SPEAKER_00]: the female menstrual cycle. Nobody could deny Peter Tobin sounded like the most potential suspect
[00:33:53] [SPEAKER_00]: for the Bible John murders, but many details contradicted the theory. First of all, Jeannie
[00:33:59] [SPEAKER_00]: Lankford said that she was certain Peter Tobin wasn't her sister's killer after seeing his
[00:34:03] [SPEAKER_00]: picture. Furthermore, Peter moved to Brighton before the murders of Jamima McDonald and Helen
[00:34:08] [SPEAKER_00]: Puttick. Peter got married on August 6th, spent his honeymoon in Brighton and was then arrested
[00:34:14] [SPEAKER_00]: on August 20th regarding an unrelated crime. Jamima McDonald was killed on August 16th,
[00:34:21] [SPEAKER_00]: so it seems Peter couldn't have been responsible for her death. Peter himself refused to cooperate
[00:34:25] [SPEAKER_00]: with the police saying he didn't care about the families of the victims and if they got closure
[00:34:30] [SPEAKER_00]: or not. He did however eventually open up to a prison pal in 2021. I am not Bible John,
[00:34:38] [SPEAKER_00]: but I did kill others. People just think I am Bible John, but I'm not, it wasn't me,
[00:34:42] [SPEAKER_00]: nothing to do with me, I didn't kill them. In the end, no evidence has been found to link
[00:34:48] [SPEAKER_00]: Peter Tobin to the Bible John murders. His DNA was tested and it didn't match the sample taken
[00:34:54] [SPEAKER_00]: from Helen Puttick's tights. And so, Peter was finally eliminated as a suspect and the police
[00:34:59] [SPEAKER_00]: had to return to the drawing board. Today, five decades after Bible John killed three young
[00:35:06] [SPEAKER_00]: women who had simply wanted to dance and have fun, we are no closer to solving the mystery.
[00:35:10] [SPEAKER_00]: The case of Patricia Docker, Jamima McDonald and Helen Puttick remain open,
[00:35:16] [SPEAKER_00]: waiting for the piece of the puzzle that would finally reveal the identity of their killer.
[00:35:27] [SPEAKER_00]: We'd like to thank today's sponsors, Typology. Go to UK.Typology.com forward slash evidence
[00:35:33] [SPEAKER_00]: and receive a free lip and cheek balm worth 16 pounds when you make a purchase,
[00:35:37] [SPEAKER_00]: that is UK.Typology.com forward slash evidence.
[00:35:41] [SPEAKER_00]: Stay focused on what's important to you with new Moets psychology based approach.
[00:35:45] [SPEAKER_00]: Sign up for your trial today at noom.com forward slash evidence locker,
[00:35:49] [SPEAKER_00]: that is noom and oom.com forward slash evidence locker. If you'd like to read more about this case,
[00:35:58] [SPEAKER_00]: have a look at the resources used for this episode in the show notes. Also, visit us on
[00:36:02] [SPEAKER_00]: social media to see more about today's case. We're on Facebook, Instagram and Twitter.
[00:36:07] [SPEAKER_00]: You can also check out our channel on YouTube. If you like what we do here at Evidence Locker,
[00:36:12] [SPEAKER_00]: subscribe in Apple Podcast or wherever you are listening right now
[00:36:15] [SPEAKER_00]: and kindly leave a five star review. This was the Evidence Locker. Thank you for listening.
